Why oh why should i bother to try for an LTR?

July 20, 2012

I just had a very interesting time exchanging with Cooper, Rich.Aubrey and Susan over at HUS stemming from a comment Cooper made in the thread Misery in the Friend Zone.

It was a comment so absolutely touching as it hit on all the latent beta in me that yearns to FEEL like there must be something more in this SMP than a simple algorithm or chess like strategy of using evolutionary excuses to justify certain behaviors while still asking for civilized action and chivalrous attitudes in an era that clearly shows they have outlived their usefulness. Without the ability to put the genie back in the bottle, can we ever get to a point where ‘love‘ actually means something tangible and concrete, rather than a ‘feeling’ that burns out as fast as it starts and becomes as dark and cold as the remnants of a Sun the burns out and dies?

Not to scale

But it all started in another thread that took on a life of it’s own..  regarding the Sexual Selection Theory.

After having read (and agreed with) Ted D[link], Esco[link] and MikeC’s[link] revulsion towards woman’s attitudes (or films portrayal of, take your pick, life imitating art imitating life i suppose) regarding a newly wedded woman’s ability to rationalize sleeping with an apex alpha that is not her husband in the following terms [off of Susan’s comment in response to user Passer_By; emphasis mine]

Susan Walsh July 19, 2012 at 9:59 am

@Passer By

“Do you think most would have said no to Elvis or Paul backstage if one of them invited one of those girls home (and they weren’t worried about pregnancy or dad finding out)?”

There’s a great scene in Woody Allen’s new movie To Rome With Love. By chance, a newlywed woman meets a movie star on the street while he’s filming, and he asks her to lunch then brings her to his hotel room. She goes into the bathroom, looks in the mirror and says this to herself:

“If you sleep with him, you will regret it for the rest of your life. If you don’t sleep with him you will regret it for the rest of your life. Regret either way, might as well sleep with him.”

I think that is a very accurate representation of the female thought process in a situation like that.

I’ll give you a couple minutes to digest that one for a moment.



Sunk in yet?



Betrothed. Wedded Bliss. Hot Alpha walks by. MY LIFE IS OVER, I WILL REGRET THIS FOREVER!

I just slept with the BEEB and we love each other and he’s so much better than you and i want a divorce because i’d regret not quitting you and let go of my hair you’re hurting me, help, POLICE im being assaulted!!!

Please kill me.

Ted followed it up all those exchanges with a killer line here:

Isn’t the whole point of wearing a wedding ring to remind you about this, and to tell everyone else you are off limits?

I was recently at a wedding to a friend of mine. It was at a Baptist church, not a Roman Catholic like i went through. It was similar but there were notable exceptions. The vows sounded a little different. Plus the Pastor(not Priest) was VERY explicit about the meaning behind the rings each partner gives the other, about the commitment it symbolized, about it being there to REMIND you that you are now connected, one flesh. He used a word, I believe it was troth but i can’t recall, that connoted the very essence of commitment. I heard the word commitment so many times, and their service was half the length of the one i went through. They take their shit seriously with regards to FUCKING COMMITMENT!!!

Mark 10:6-9
Holman Christian Standard Bible (HCSB)

6 But from the beginning of creation God[a] made them male and female. [b]
7 For this reason a man will leave
his father and mother
[and be joined to his wife],[c]
8 and the two will become one flesh. [d]
So they are no longer two, but one flesh. 9 Therefore what God has joined together, man must not separate.”

[I hope you appreciate this, i’m digging up a lot of stuff that could cause me to spontaneously combust right now]

So you can see a row has already developed based on the apparent inability of women to grasp the severity of the meaning of commitment. As Cooper so deftly pointed out… modern women today treat wedding vows like a ‘mood‘, and not a legally binding pact that it is before their chosen deity.

Truly Christ is weeping!

One wonders how well they do when they try to explain to the phone company why they shouldn’t pay the ETF fees for terminating their contracts because they want the shiny red phone that the other wireless carrier sells.

So now we get to the Friendzone thread and Danny opens up with a comment on tips for breaking out of or converting a friendzone into a romancezone:[emphasis always mine from here on]

dannyfrom504July 19, 2012 at 1:29 am

i’ve been on more than one date where the girls said afterwards she wasn’t “feeling it” but she’d love to see me again.


my response- “no, no point in that. apparently i’m looking for a romantic partner, and you’re looking for a sucker. it was fun, ni-night.”

i’ve actually had women escalate after doing that.

Susan replied immediatly with:

I have witnessed girls going from “I don’t want to see his penis!” to “I want to hook up with him” based on nothing more than a well played response to LJBF.

Which had Cooper shaking his head at 101, and poor Richard Aubrey completely mortified and in disbelief at 103:

Richard Aubrey July 19, 2012 at 2:25 pm

… “”I have witnessed girls going from “I don’t want to see his penis!” to “I want to hook up with him” based on nothing more than a well played response to LJBF.””

This has to be a joke. Please? In my world, women are NOT THAT DUMB.

Richard.. i wan’t to live in your world. But sadly, that world can only be accessed by using the Tesseract, and we all know there’s nothing but trouble awaiting you when you play with that thing.

Susan quickly answers the call to explain to Richard that yes.. women are NOT THAT DUMB!

This is how it goes:

Guy is supplicating, eager and devoted. Every action towards his beloved kills the tingle. She LJBFs him. He says, “I’m outta here” and starts hanging out with other people, including some girls. Beloved finds herself piqued that Guy is not paying attention to her. Guy says, “I’m done being your bitch. Fuck off.” Beloved tingles like mad.

Of course, this is dependent on Guy being able to go balls to the wall and be a hardass. If he can do it, his odds are probably 50/50.

After hearing that rousing defense of women’s intelligence Richard quips:

Susan. In your world, women are that dumb. Too bad. If it works, jeez it’s awful to contemplate.

Who am i to argue 🙂

Now in my best “V” voice..

It is at this point in our story that along comes a idealist: He is a man seemingly with an enormous conscience for whom the ends do not always justify the means, and it is he who suggests that the target of hypergamy is not simply an enemy of the BETA, but rather of LOVE itself.

I will put Cooper’s entire comment up here because his words that he wrote are the words i struggled to find on my own for over 15 years, unable to seize them from my thoughts and put pen to paper. His ‘rant’ if you will, describes so eloquently the fence i currently occupy, unable to determine my next move forward in this forever damaged SMP.

Cooper July 19, 2012 at 9:02 pm

@Susan #107

Isn’t that the sadness thing, though?

I don’t know if you remember the time I shared the story about how I learned to be content with what I have, and no ever seek “greener fields.”
It was when I was very young, and kids used to argue/negotiate tirelessly to trade their toys for anothers toy. And the remorse one felt after successfully trading, and realizing that you never even wanted the thing THAT bad, and thus was the lesson of “greener on the other side.”
Is this what female-attraction boils down to? Seeking what you can’t have?

The lesson from the “greener field” metaphor is that the condition of each field is irrelevant, and it’s simply the perception for each side that makes one desire the other.
So, how can women go from being appauled by supplicating behavior (hence the LJBF attempt) to “OMG I need him in my pants!”?
Since it happens, I can’t help but conclude women’s attraction ques are as immature as I was when I was 4 – powerless to the whims of desire (fooled by the greener field).
It’s so so silly that you can accept that a women’s attraction has very little to do with the qaulity of the suitor at hand, and much much more to do with his availability towards her.
How can Game (learning to wave around an empty hand, whilst hiding the ball in your off-hand) be the appropriate solution!!

I apologize for the rant, but I’ve been heavily into this whole human-sexuality, Game, attraction, ect. for nearly 6-months now, and I still haven’t been reassured about what I’m looking for is evem possible, or culturally existant. I want to believe that LOVE exist! And that life-long commitment is achievable.
But the more, and more, I learn I find increasing evidence that suggest character, quality, ect. are meaningless.. And that combat-dating strategies are the only truth that exist, and the moment one relinquishes themselves to another they become worthless to that person. It’s all just a neverendigngbattle for power-position, principle-of-least-interest, who has more options elsewhere, who’s playing hard to get, ect.
Are we all seriously dogs chasing an empty hand!!!? (most of my questions are rhetorical, if not always)

How can we just accept that attraction is all about how one waves around their hands. Have you ever tried to fight someone for the attention of a dog? It’s pointless, the dog is just going to follow whoever waves the most. Why would anyone seriously bother themselves with trying to maintain that attention, when it’s completely unpredictable.

Sorry, in my defence I have just come off a weekend where 5 of my peers (3girls, 2guys) all agreed that marriage isn’t natural, and that they all actually agreed to “punch each other in the face” if they consider getting married.

“Guy is supplicating, eager and devoted. Every action towards his beloved kills the tingle. She LJBFs him. He says, “I’m outta here” and starts hanging out with other people, including some girls. Beloved finds herself piqued that Guy is not paying attention to her. Guy says, “I’m done being your bitch. Fuck off.” Beloved tingles like mad.”
AAAAAAAHHHHGGGGGG!!!!!! *bangs head on desk*

In my heart, i believe what i truly looked for as a beta is forever gone. An illusion that day by day, article by article, admission by admission by women that the 30 year long beta poisoning my system suffered in believing that real love existed… NEVER REALLY EXISTED! In it’s place we see more and more women regressing into their natural states.

DALROCK speaks of women going feral here. [link]

Commenter Brutus provided a link to another disheartening article here. [link]

And each time i see or read these things, look back to my own wondeful experience with the exwife who just ‘quit’ on me, our marriage, our life together, have MANY stories of women leaving, divorcing, dumping men in my immediate family back in Poland, my brother being let go, and cheated on, and not finding ONE instance of a man leaving a woman within that same sample pool. If i expand the pool to friends, the numbers become staggering in terms of women leaving men. I can only note of 1 man leaving a woman, but in that case.. it was MUTUAL.

The story of the man trading up his old and aging wife is more Urban Legend than reality. The only place you’ll find that happen frequently is in Hollywood and celebrity. There they have the money, resources and lawyers to deal with such messy breaks in a minimum of time. One even wonders why Hollywood types bother anymore.. it’s almost like a ritual they have to perform to stay in the spotlight. Oh my star power is waning? Time for a divorce and put me back in the headlines. Out in the real world.. it’s women kicking men to the curb at a 2 to 1 clip because most men know the shit storm they’re up against if they try to divorce. I would surmise the 1/3rd of men who do initiate are often choosing the lesser of two evils. Fight it out in divorce court or watch her hate you, make your life hell and fuck around on you while you sleep on the couch as she refuses to start divorce proceedings because living in the home without any disruption works just fine. It’s a wonder why more men don’t shoot themselves more often. Ohhh wait….

Goodbye cruel word

So i ask again.. why should i bother trying for an LTR? Perhaps the Nihilists and the Hedonists are right? You can’t fight what human nature is… so come to the dark side and join us in a pussy slaying poon fest!

I don’t know if i’m there yet.. but every day takes me closer to seeing that women only ever look out for number one. THEY DON’T EVEN DENY IT ANYMORE.

And you can’t have true love if you put yourself before your partner.

And if that’s the case, then i guess true love doesn’t exist. How can it if one half of the population is incapable of superseding their chro-mag tendencies to jump ship if the right ship comes sailing by?

I think i’ll sit on the fence for just a bit longer and ponder. I have the luxury since i’m going my own way.

Yes, i’m sitting on a fence. Fuck off!

I hope you all enjoyed this little ramble because i just realised it’s 1:21am and i gotta get up for work. Bah.

I just stayed up all night to write this shite. That shit be kray.. fish filet. Now let the sleep take me away.


  1. Great stuff… Grim topic, but I always get a good chuckle out of the photos you include on the post.

    Re: that link from Brutus… I’ve spent some time around college and pro athletes, and his experience matches what I’ve seen too. It was honestly my first dose of the red pill.

  2. “That’s the nature of women, not to love when we love them, and to love when we love them not.”

    “Love and war are the same thing, and stratagems and policy are as allowable in the one as in the other.”

    “No padlocks, bolts, or bars can secure a maiden better than her own reserve.”

    All three of those quotes originate from Miguel de Cervantes, a renown Spanish novelist. All three quotes together epitomize the essence of Game within the realm of male female relationships.

    Quote #1

    This is just a fact of human nature. Let’s stop putting value judgements of good or bad on it…it just is. What few most (beta) men fail to realize is that women will not feel any yearning in their loins once they’ve received the love they crave. Its simple psychology. Would you feel motivated to work if you got a check whether you showed up or not?

    Just like K9 dogs you have got to make a conscious effort to keep them motivated with direct rewards for desired behaviors. Most men inadvertently REWARD women for their BAD behavior.

    Quote #2

    Any relationship requires a conscious effort to maintain tension. If the male is not creating the tension then she will bring the drama in an effort to bring tension enter her life. If that tension happens to involve a party outside of the relationship…you are screwed.

    Recognizing that love is war keeps a man on his toes with the realization that a failure to keep her loins stimulated for long gaps of time will lead to the enemy of apathy to creep in and catch hold like a virulent infection.

    If indeed “the cost of liberty is eternal vigilance” then the cost of long term female companionship is incessant interminable GAME.

    Quote #3

    Contrary to the bullshit that the Ministry of Truth Division of Lies has put out there to the masses, women CAN be understood on a basic rudimentary level. Game is about “maximizing the probability of a favorable outcome in any given situation”. http://wp.me/p26lRt-hr

    Maximizing favorable outcomes means choosing women for commitment who aren’t going to make a spur of the moment decision to sit on some sport star or movie stars cock. They ARE out there. The problem is most men let the pussy blind them and they end up committing despite that silent inner voice telling them that the chances of this woman being chaste and faithful is about is probable as the sun rising in the west.

    As for love, its like debating UFO’s and the existence of other dimensions. Way way too impractical. Besides, “those who refuse to acknowledge game empowers his rivals” and love has blinded far too many men to the whims and wiles of female desire.

  3. Wow. Loaded guns, you have them.

    Having had a bottle of wine over the course of a skype debate with friends, I feel ya. These are all the same men I referenced in my latest post. They all couldn’t stick to a single side of debate – emotional, rational, etc, when talking about mens and women’s roles in both relationships and marriage.

    As for whether LTR’s are worth it….

    I think individual women can be worth it if they understand hypergamy and the natural desire of women to be submissive and supportive. Anything less… not worth it. You will fight constant battles with a woman who has the full backing of society. in other words, you’ll fight constant battles and constantly lose.

    Women’s attraction cues aren’t immature at all. They’re just based on COMPLETELY separate things than men’s attraction cues are in that they’re based on social positioning over physicality and over any moral/mental issues. Those all come back seat. Its not that they’re bad, or immature. They’re just evolved for a world of strife and discord. So they chose for a world of strife and discord, and if they don’t have such a world they’ll create one to see if you stand up to it.

    Which is why I’d never get with a woman that didn’t understand hypergamy and at least try to control such urges.

    “Guy says, “I’m done being your bitch. Fuck off.” Beloved tingles like mad.

    Of course, this is dependent on Guy being able to go balls to the wall and be a hardass. If he can do it, his odds are probably 50/50.”

    So. If he can prove that he is the worst person to provide for and care for a child…. he’s rewarded with a child….

    And you then expect men learning this to hold women in high esteem.

    I understand the evolutionary psychology behind it. I understand the chemical reactions that take place in a woman’s body that causes these things. I accept those. I work with those.

    But that people like Susan than expect men to take ALL WOMEN as marriage material and treat them like such instead of using every light, grey, and dark form of game that shows us the reality of what they are……

    To say that we should just man up and be exactly what they want us to be…..

    To say that we have no right to criticize her audience, or women, in general as to what we want while they have every right to criticize us….

    Well, its an obvious raw deal. I’d be interested with talking with any woman the believes such, but Susan has already shown she simply doesn’t give a damn about my opinion despite efforts to change my tone, be productive, and search for a solution.

    So. The world is my oyster. I’ll pillage it as I can, avoid rape charges in search of women that want me, and give the finger to anyone that wants my hard earned money.

  4. Good stuff, M3. Dating a chick you dig too much is like visiting a posh resort: you get bedazzled by the furniture, the pretty bed spread, the cool pictures on the wall; you love the room service and the nifty little doodads they bring along with the great food under the silver platters; you gorge at the all you can eat buffet; you walk about the grounds, admiring the beautiful landscape and even indulge in a bit of crochet or putting; but in the end, it isn’t home, you know you will be leaving at the end of a short stay. You can either enjoy yourself while it happens, and live life to the max knowing that it will soon end, or you can spend the time lamenting that your “real” life sucks in comparison, and bitching and moaning that your short stay that you love so much will all too soon come to an end.

    Me, I’m prone to being nostalgic for the way I think women should act, knowing full well how they really are. Damn, I harumph, IF ONLY WOMEN ACTED THE WAY I THINK THEY SHOULD LIFE WOULD BE SO GRAND! As Tom Beringer’s character said in Platoon: “There’s the way life is, and the way life ought to be…”

    Just keep reminding yourself the way women are. Every. Damn. One. Of them.

  5. Man this is funny. Comments:

    – Susan would get herself banned, if her own comments were written by a guy.

    – Guys are clueless. Truly.

    “And you can’t have true love if you put yourself before your partner.”

    – Truly.

    Let’s try to be succint. eh.

    The SMP and the hormones and stuff arent there so you can have true love. They are there to help you breed and to maximize your offspring survival.

    You dont get a boner when you see a hot girl because you want true love. You dont want to compete and prove and you dont get all the angst and all the drive that lets you do wonderful, and often stupid stupid things for “girls” so you can have true love.

    At the same time, status is for girls what hotness is for guys. Or, hotness, from the girl’s point of view, it’s a compendium of many things, where physical appereance is just one trait.

    Just to touch the tip of it: masculinity has a surplus of resources (sperm), or should, and femininity has limited resources (ovules), or should. Plus the femininity has to feed the baby and the masculinity should stay around to make war with external aggressors and protect her and the baby. Oh. Maybe that feeling, the whole thing, you can call love. But we’re really talking instinct.


    When you see a girl you like you get that boner or you dont. There’s no talking you into it. Or there shouldnt. But, let’s say you’re looking at a girl that doesnt particularly arouse you, until you see her naked, then wow! now we’re talking. But then she turns around and you see her ass and is ugly, and your boner goes off. But then she comes closer with that look in her eyes etc? and the boner comes again. Or she goes away for a while and comes back somehow prettier. Or, she was a very very pretty girl, and you see her years after and she’s jaded and gray, and uglier, and you feel pity instead of getting a boner. Sad right?

    So what’s love have to do with it? nothing.

    Girls are looking for Mr. Right. This is “the man” whos the best prospect, and who has chances of sticking around. However, girls usually have other people who can stick around for them, friends family the state etc. And thanks to feminism they dont need a man to stick around – they can make their own money. So mr. Right is, basically, the hottest, higher value, more fit man they can snatch.

    Hypergamy for short term.

    What’s love have to do with it? nothing.

    Hormones, attraction, selection, screening, all the stuff that was there to increase your survival, all the pain and pleasure and the chemical cocktail.

    It’s all about the sex. It is a highly emotional issue for girls. It’s all passional and breath taking, and feelings of “love” are in it, too. But it’s all about the sex.

    Men screen for the hottest girl, girls screen for the more fit man. And it’s all about the sex.


    We’re basically a tournament species. We built a huge society that needs other arrangements… but at our core we’re still tournament. The guys compete. The girls cheer. The girls cheer like crazy and faint for the stars. The guys lock down practicing and making money and trying to climb. The ones who succeed get big rewards. The winners are more attractive. The losers, nobody wants them. Some guys are born at the top and already attractive – and girls do faint for them, think of prince Harry, think of… you know. Some guys are born at the bottom and climb, and they also get faints and stuff as long as they werent too Omega or were able to climb enough to prove they belonged up there to begin with.

    We’re organized in a way where the winners are the most attractive. And, girls, or, the feminine, is built to screen for the traits the winners have. The result is that the vast majority of girls are screening for the top guys, and that’s it.

    Got it? stop whining about hypergamy. For every girl who only feels attracted to the top guys and is rejecting beta nice guys… there’s a guy whos practicing and improving himself and trying to climb, so he becomes mr right. We have hypergamy for the same reason we have the male sex drive. You wouldnt want this in any other way. Or I wouldnt.

    So. Girls are screening for the guys at the top, and, the guys at the top have options, and, have more social value than the girls.

    Say whatever you want about girls and stars and stuff. You know the maximum value a girl can have in society, in the SMP, is being wanted. Girls values being wanted. By whom?

    Because top guy’s value is what they built.

    Top girl’s value is being wanted and purchased by the top guys. And top top guys can purchase more than one top girl.

    Am I hurting your sensibilities again? Masculinity is about surplus, having it, producing it, and spending it. Look at dicaprio. And remember when you felt more admiration for Brad Pitt before he decided to put all of his seeds in the same sack.

    Femininity is about controlling and being wise with your limited resources, maximizing it’s value, attracting the best of the best seed. That’s why you get disgusted when you see a hot, hot girl, all drunk and messing around with a “loser”. You know she’s worth more.

    So what’s love have to do with this? nothing.


    When people talk about true love, the love in movies etc… they are usually talking about this mystical team and soul matey thing where to people compliment each other and bond for life and do all kind of marvellous things together.

    There’s an angle, the spiritual one, which transcends the form, the shape of things and goes to the bone. Unconditional love.

    Unconditional love can be all ways of sick (love you and accept you even if you become an abusive drug addict), but, true love in its most abstract form is when this feeling of love just goes and surrenders and fills the other person without an ego on it, without a form, without a business. True love in it’s spiritual way it’s like giving all of your money to somebody, then doing it again, then doing it again.

    Yes. So unconditional love can be stupid. Surrendering to true love and loving to its fullest, can be stupid. That’s why screening is so important. And if you plan on loving someone forever… screening is all. You have to screen for someone who’s not just going to take all of your gifts and leave you in the dumpster.

    And screening isnt love. Screening is well, screening.

    But, back to love.


    What people really talk about when this “true love” comes in play, is acceptance. Is ego validation.

    See. Only beta and nice guys talk about this shit. Girls are not interested in true love. You dont see them chasing true love. What they care is about finding mr Right. Maybe they have true love with mr Right… but you get what Im getting at?

    Betas and nice guys and under are after true love because they dont have.

    This is the killer:

    Betas and nice guys need love, because true love is their only chance at survival.

    True love is the only way they could have love and survive at all.

    True love is the only way someone would want to be with them.

    True love – a soul mate, is the only way they could attract a hot girl and pass their genes.

    True love is, simply, salvation from the SMP.

    True love, for a beta nice guy, is finding someone who loves them at expenses of their value in the SMP.

    True love means someone who’s with you and sees value in you even when you dont find that value in yourself.

    True love = you got lucky. Which is a shorty for “I dont know what the fuck is going on”

    True love is for suckers.

    Because while the beta nice guy is feeling lucky and thinks he found salvation and yada yada, the girl is all aware about his status of mr Right, knows where he fits, where he doesnt, where his strengths are, where his weakness are.

    There’s no innocence on about it.

    You keep dreaming about true love while she’s taking this seriously. You keep being a romantic, where shes doing a real business here.

    See. For girls, other than the kids if she has them, finding and bonding and pairing with mr right is all that matters.

    Sure, you can have “true love” when you’re in the union. You can exchange the sweet energy and couple and make the machine move and have a partnership. But with girls, the WHO is more important than the WHAT.

    Guys have a surplus and can fool around. Heck. Some guys even have several families at the same time.

    For girls this is deadly serious. Limited resources and investment.

    LJBF -> STUD

    So, back to the original topic. You had a guy who was chasing her around, putting her on a pedestal and all. A guy putting her on a pedestal = needy = loser = unattractive, which just means she can get better.

    See, the top guys that girls are after, have options, and options mean these top guys are not worried about “true love” being the salvation. The beautiful thing about the top guys is that, fuck, they SCREEN as well.

    How does your concept of true love stand up against “screening” girls because you have too many options, and many of them could be “true love”, and, heck, you can have “true love” with several of them at the same time?

    Do I hear some hearts cracking?

    So the top guys not only have a surplus of resources but also a surplus of options where to invest them. If you know about economy you’ll see that makes all these options have a diminished value, lower than if they were your only option or you needed any specific one as “salvation”. Salvation from WHAT for God’s sake.

    So the top guys have options. This translates to cockyness, to a stronger frame control, to stronger boundaries, to a lighter humor, to cruelty in some cases, to power, to abuse of power, to increased responsibility, to self autonomy, self reliance, to not caring about others, to being a badass, to having your own ideas and goals to be more important than everyone elses -> thus leading other men into reaching your goals. Etc.

    And femininity is built to screen and be attracted and want to pair and bond and reproduce with such traits. The girl feels attracted to such traits, just like a guy gets a boner with a good ass and tits and an angelical face. Deal with it.

    So, the guys at the top have options, and they screen back.

    The process of screening girls back is called teasing / push pull / etc. When a girl finds a guy whos able to screen and is not just running, chasing after each girl, all desperate because he doesnt know better nor has better, she feels “fuck, finally I find a real man”

    Do you see it? a real man, mr right, is also a guy who doesnt need and is not after real love. A guy who screens back and can push back. A guy who might “want” real love, but who has it with a price tag. And a price tag she has to pay for.

    “All the other guys… try to chase her. But here’s her number, so call her, maybe.”

    So back to topic. You had this guy who was chasing her -> showing her how little he’s worth and not reading her un-boner well, till the point she says “lets just be friends”. Then this guy cuts contact? resumes his life? shows her that she doesnt “need” her and is having fun?

    That’s an immediate boost in value, because he doesnt need, doesnt supplicate, is having fun = has more value, has more options, maybe he’s above her after all, and maybe if she comes back and says hi he is going to SCREEN her after all, instead of falling at her feet, and thus, below her.

    Girls need a guy who stands up above of herself. Girls dont need men who put them on a pedestal etc. You knew that already.

    So yes, the moment he drops the pedestal, she´ll want him more.

    And that’s quite smart.

  6. edited into a post http://yohami.com/blog/2012/07/20/so-why-bother-with-a-long-term-relationship/

  7. I’d like to post this again. This really jarred me HARD.

    Susan Walsh July 19, 2012 at 9:59 am
    @Passer By

    “Do you think most would have said no to Elvis or Paul backstage if one of them invited one of those girls home (and they weren’t worried about pregnancy or dad finding out)?”

    There’s a great scene in Woody Allen’s new movie To Rome With Love. By chance, a newlywed woman meets a movie star on the street while he’s filming, and he asks her to lunch then brings her to his hotel room. She goes into the bathroom, looks in the mirror and says this to herself:

    “If you sleep with him, you will regret it for the rest of your life. If you don’t sleep with him you will regret it for the rest of your life. Regret either way, might as well sleep with him.”

    I think that is a very accurate representation of the female thought process in a situation like that.”

    Susan’s words again:

    The idea that a woman should sleep with an apex alpha because well, she’ll regret it either way, so she might as well sleep with him is a “very accurate representation of the female thought process in a situation like that.””

    Again: this is a “very accurate representation of the female thought process in a situation like that.””

    Yohami has said things like this at HUS. Susan thinks he’s a woman hater.

    I have pointed out in other threads: Right man, right time, irght circumstances, low detection risk = cheating.

    It’s things like this that make me sometimes just want to say f**k it and GMOW. If all this is true, then there is no point at all to coupling, to love, to marriage, to LTRs, or even to STRs. There is only f**king.

  8. Yup, me saying that makes me a woman hater. She saying the same thing makes her… incoherent. But at least she’s right.

    Fucking the alpha stud trumps all.

  9. To be fair, that process describes men too. Put a hottie in the right circumstance at the right time etc. The boner will be there, and the mental process as well. And a vast majority of men will cheat.

    So will women.

  10. Each and every one of you have made awesome points, and i am loathe to even try to argue any of it because it makes so much sense.


    Once again someone managed to craft an even better response than the one i intended to write basically saying ‘I get that it’s how it works on a primal level, but commitment, especially in the 21st century is a contract and a guarantee that has wide reaching implications if not followed through, marriage or otherwise. The ability to keep a promise or see something through requires the use of your rational brain, not your animal one’ which was the context of my post.

    But Rich Aubrey put really put the power into it with this comment here:

    I’m not disagreeing with you, rather, if it’s not possible to expect women to honor commitment because of their evolutionary attraction triggers, then perhaps marriage should simply be wiped out altogether? We can’t blame them for it but why should we continue to offer a service/product/whatever that one side of the gender equation is doomed to continually fail to uphold?

    And at what point would evolutionary reason cease to be justification for actions? If i came home and was startled by people throwing me a surprise party.. i am sure the judge would not bother listening to me argue how my ancestors would have registered the surprise as an imminent assault and my instincts for self preservation kicked in and murdered all the aggressors by beating them to death with my laptop bag.

    This is madness.

  11. M3: if it’s not possible to expect women to honor commitment because of their evolutionary attraction triggers, then perhaps marriage should simply be wiped out altogether? We can’t blame them for it but why should we continue to offer a service/product/whatever that one side of the gender equation is doomed to continually fail to uphold?

    This is what the ‘old rules’ (religion, social mores, shaming, family property rights, etc.) were for. To keep female hypergamy in check. This not only provided incentive to the vast majority of non-natural-alpha males to contribute to building and maintaining a safe and stable society, but also benefited women, because in a survival-of-the-fittest jungle, well, let’s face it – women are the weak meat. Thus, the rules and traditions were really there not to oppress women, but to protect society, and by extension the women themselves, from their own feral, self-destructive nature.

    So, how does this apply in today’s society where the rules have changed? It doesn’t. The game has changed. The old rules no longer apply, and players who try to follow them end up penalized more often than not.

    Well, when the game is rigged, he who plays by the rules loses.
    That is to say, when the game is rigged, there are no rules.

    When women choose (or are forced) to play by the old rules again, so will men. Until then, they reap what they sow, and men should feel neither hesitation nor shame in looking out for themselves by understanding the new rules and game strategies, and acting accordingly.

  12. I do believe most women, in general, would sleep with say, Rob Pattinson, Taylor Lautner or Brad Pitt if they got the chance, regardless of his or her relationship status.

    I wouldn’t, and I’ve been backstage with rock stars. But my girlfriends who were with me, behaved very badly.

  13. I checked out the post “Misery in the Friend Zone.” Did I read your comment correctly, that you (M3) were friendzoned by a woman? Has she seen you with your shirt off??

  14. Did you read about Kristen/Robert over at Heartiste… poignant that even alpha Pattinson gets cheated on.. since all things being equal (their hollywood status) she ramps her hypergamy to a whole new level. He’s alpha by perception only based on his hollywood status making him out of reach for 99% of all women. But the 1% that are in hollywood with the same fame/status/money/looks/celebrity revert right back to normal SMP rules and poor Pattinson goes through what a whole lot of guys go through. Classic and an eye opener.


  15. LOL. yes she did, amongst other things. unfortunately, over 17 years of beta-orbiting ‘friendship’ was too much to undo. even after we played around for a bit, she tried to shove me back into the friend box and said it was making her uncomfortable thinking about me ‘sexually’ and wasn’t looking for a boyfriend. So that was the end of that, i don’t play 3rd wheel ever again.

  16. Is she a lesbian?

    ‘Cause any normal red-blooded woman is not going to “friend box” you once you take off your shirt. You don’t need “game” you just need to take off your shirt.

  17. Im liking this girl more and more.

  18. +1 🙂

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